Some of the writings here are being forwarded to other lists by other individuals. The remarks below are from one of such lists.
For your information.
Dear Divine Avyakt 7 –
From my side of coin whatever I am stating is true and clearly visible. That is my truth. From your side of coin whatever you say is your truth. Unless we exchange our sides we will not know the real truth, not ur truth, nor my truth. Otherwise some third person has to see both the sides of the coin without having any prejudice then only he can see the real truth.
Science laws of matter can’t be applicable to spirituality, in Toto. Yes, we can make use of them to understand spirituality to convince ourselves or others.(I use it to convince others too) But still they may or may not be truly applicable. Entropy is observed here due to gravity and air or water resistance. So we presume gravity & resistance & apply to spirituality as well. Whereas in the vacuum the entropy will perhaps not be there, unless experimented. The ball will roll on endlessly continuously eternally.
From Avyakt 7 – you presume —
There is no awareness of “time” for the soul. Because there is no experience of time for a soul, distance does not exist as well. Therefore, there is no sense of “ever going away,” in the soul realm, in soul consciousness.
Distance and thus, separation only exists while in the consciousness of the physical body. That is why, we have the separations of “you and me,” “God and me,” etc. Ego means separation at the spiritual level, just as “time-distance” is separation at the physical level.
However, because at the soul level there is no separation, being at the consciousness of the soul means, to be ONE, to be merged, to be “the same as the Father.” 🙂
At the soul level, the idea of individuality is non-existent. Only at the physical level, this separation exists.
My views –
The presumption about soul, time and space which you made, is from my side of coin ridiculous. These presumptions may lead you (in another body) to state god is omnipresent and soul merges into supreme soul during Bhakti time. You are that one who made us to wander. Baba descending down or refusing to come down for last 2 meetings is meaningless as He or every soul spread without any boundaries in space or in time! The inverted tree has no meaning. We just spread, may be overlapping or encroaching on one another. Br. Jagdish when was in Subtle region and looked down he saw the world like seeing something from balcony of a house. Dadi Kumarka coming down and expressing herself through Gulzardadi is just fake. These are few after effects of your thoughts and diverting or polluting the minds of the thinkers, which is wrong which is sin created unknowingly, because misguiding makes other’s to wander). This is caution and not a judgment.
Even Mala of 108 or 16,108 etc. is meaningless, soul can’t be compared to a bead as the idea of individuality is non-existent.
Soul may not be thumb-shaped, may not be point but still it exists in whatever subtle shape. It can’t be all occupying omnipresent. (How will you take your seat next to me in the inverted tree? Think & throw light.)
Time according to me is counted on the distance between two events. In soul world there is no physical event (no movement) no subtle movement as no thoughts (so distance between 2 thoughts will not be there) so it is timeless.
But space is there. Abundant! we occupy just a little bit.
Most of the times I feel the moderator brings your idea’s for knowing us how to think differently. But now I think the moderator should first read, check and serve us or should write’ the views expressed here may or may not be agreeable to the moderator’, like the editors do.
Br. Sorry if it pinches you; please accept my apologies in advance.
In many articles I have explained already that the “truth” according to gyan, comes from the perception of the role that we are playing, according to time. Baba’s truth, is the “truth” for a Brahmin soul at this time, but we cannot extrapolate that to say that it should be applied to everyone in the world at this time or that they should be able to “see it.” To believe that is sheer dogma; for the Drama itself is showing us that “variety” at this time is the rule. A Christian soul will have the capacity to understand only what Christianity teaches. This is a fact of pure gyan. A gyani soul will respect that rather than trying to find a third party who is unbiased to ‘decide’ what the truth is.
Sorry, but I do not play that game. There is no one without biases or prejudices, but there is understanding and that is not “equal,” but numberwise.
Even among Brahmin souls, our understanding is numberwise. Again, one more time….our understanding is not the same, but “numberwise.” Another fact of gyan.
Therefore, if you cannot see the ‘points’ that this role is making, that is expected and I respect your viewpoints as well, although not necessarily I will agree with them.
I use the laws of physics when applicable in the physical world. I have used those laws to explain the cycle of time. I am not looking to convince anyone. I am just sharing what I have found to be ‘true.’ I have shared those articles in different places. I have gotten replies back on them. The following article was “understood” by many, as you can see for yourself, when using the physical laws to explain this “role” viewpoints.
Please review the second law of thermodynamics (entropy) and the way it is applied in gyan by Bro. Jagdish. Certainly, it is not near the interpretation that you are bringing.
Bro, Jagdish and not myself is the one who introduced the concept of entropy into gyan. However, I guarantee that because it was him and not me, that even though the concept is not truly understood, it “should be the truth.” Typical human behavior. There, the perceived “truth” comes out of hierarchy rather than understanding.
Entropy is experienced by all matter. Nothing escapes that. That is why it is a “law” in physics. That ball will be degenerating in time and the “vacuum” containing that ball as well. As a matter of fact, in the reality of “pure gyan,” that ball cannot go “endlessly,” for there is a limit of 5000 years before things start all over again… see?
My views of your views.
I understand your views. I must say that searching for a “escape goat,” to assure your position as “right,” is expected. You have lots of imagination as well, for you are able to interpret things which I haven’t mentioned neither implied.
Therefore, the “sin” is over your head for implying those things which I haven’t said. However, I decided to share that “sin” with you, by publishing it here. 🙂
Dear soul, If your mind wants to wander into whatever, don’t blame it on me. You have the option not to read any of these articles. Please be careful, do not get influenced by this material! 🙂 Now, please do not play “savior” by trying to save the other “children” from reading these articles. They have the right if they wish to do so.
It seems to me that there are certain topics like “paradoxes” which you are not grasping correctly, and if you would like to have an introduction to it, I invite you to read the articles here!
In your point: “Soul may not be thumb-shaped, may not be point but still it exists in whatever subtle shape. It can’t be all occupying omnipresent. (How will you take your seat next to me in the inverted tree? Think & throw light.)”
Answer: I will bring my own chair! 🙂 Dear soul, I am not disputing that the soul does not exist. It exists! Most of the articles here and my own experiences are about the experience of the soul.
In Parandham, there is no time. No distance. No perception of space time as we know it. That is why I explained that the picture of the inverted tree basically explains that our “position,” means our capacity in a numberwise way. Already published that article last week.
On your other point: “But space is there. Abundant! we occupy just a little bit.”
Answer: If you occupy space, you are material, physical being. Does a ghost occupy space?
The best answer is “yes and no.” That answer varies according to your awareness and understanding. See?
Dear soul, I thank you for sending your views, for I have learned the reason why BapDada treats us like little children when explaining us gyan. Unfortunately for me, (maybe not) this role is meant to write in a different way. Some souls will obtain benefit, some may not. That is the game, you cannot please everyone.
Thanks to the Drama, there is greater openness to publish ideas now. New ideas, new points, which otherwise, wouldn’t be even considered.
This role is just fascinated by gyan and its depth, and this role will not settle for shallow waters when the ocean is deep. I appreciate the role of “moderators” who are willing to publish some of the churnings here, for it shows openness to learn, to investigate, to find truth rather than being stagnant with dogmatic views and understanding which do not reflect the fact that gyan is not “static,” but new points will emerge as our understanding/awareness opens up.
Just do not expect those points to come up from the “senior sister” some place. Those points can come up from anywhere and anyone…. Even from me… 🙂 BapDada has no set “ownership” on this knowledge.
As a matter of fact, if any of the things that I am sharing is bothering you, try to see the “positive,” rather than the “negative,” that is what BapDada teaches us after all.