Tagged: asochta

Comment: Baba beyond experiences

Reader wrote:

It is mentioned in one of the murlis that God is Abhogta, Asochta and akarta. If we literally go into the meaning of the words, it will become confusing to understand the real God. God is Abhogta means that he is beyond the effect of experience as he doesn’t have a physical body. He is asochta doesn’t mean he has no thoughts. But he has only positive (kalyankari) thoughts for all souls. He loves every soul. He doesn’t hate anyone. He is all perfect. He does not have normal mundane thoughts/ waste or negative thoughts. He is not judgemental. He doesn’t think in terms of duality- good or bad. He is akarta means he is not bounded by the law of karma while we have to bear the consequences of our actions. But it doesn’t mean he does nothing. He comes into this world to make this impure world pure by giving us knowledge.

In the foundation course of BKWSU, it elucidates that the soul has 7 original qualities or Gun. These are peace, love, happiness, purity, knowledge, power and bliss. It is who we are, our identity. Whereas, God is the ocean of all these 7 qualities. Through our physical bodies, we can experience/feel these 7 qualities of the soul. Today, we have forgotten our true identity. Therefore, when we are soul conscious, only then we experience permanent happiness. God cannot experience but in fact is knowledge-full, bliss-full and love-full. He is complete.

Avyakt7 responds:
Dear soul,
Thank you for your input.
I like your explanation of not taking things “literally,” however, your explanation may need to be reconsidered.

If God is beyond experience because “he doesn’t have a physical body,” then how God speaks: “This is hell, this is the brothel.” Isn’t that a thought based on an experience? Isn’t that a judgment based on a personal experience?

Isn’t the experience of this world being “tasteless” (as the Sakar Murli mentioned today 2/26/13) an experience which has produced a thought? Isn’t that something which “God speaks”?

To say that “God has only positive thoughts for souls” is to incur in duality. In the Golden age where there is no duality, do you believe that Laxmi will think of Narayan as a “good guy”? or that she has “pure feelings for Him”?

That is not even thought of.

When the word “akarta” comes as “doing nothing,” I believe is the right explanation of that word. When there is no ego, there is “no one doing” anything. God is egoless. There is Drama “doing” through different roles. That is how someone could be a detached observer. Also, God is not “giving us knowledge” when as you mentioned in your second paragraph that “knowledge is a quality of a soul.” We already have knowledge. God merely reminds us, thus; remembrance. We have forgotten, but it is in us already.

Therefore, to say “God has entered this one” Shall we take that literally? When we know that knowledge was in Brahma Baba’s role all the time? 🙂

Best wishes!

Question: dear soul Omshanti. “Baba is beyond experiences” does it mean baba can’t feel anything; at the same time when we say he is ocean of love, purity, peace and happiness?

Dear soul,
Beyond experiences means that God cannot experience. 🙂 Please read this article your answer will be there.

Every soul is the embodiment of peace, love, etc, etc in a numberwise manner. If we want to call God “the ocean of those qualities” rather than a “lake,” that is fine. Words are not the experience. We are numberwise. God is not.

Best wishes!

Point in depth: “I am abhogta, asochta and akarta”

“Baba says: Here, you don’t need to bow at anyone’s feet. I am Abhogta (beyond any effect of experience), Asochta (One who is free from thoughts) and Akarta (One who doesn’t do anything). You children are even greater than the Father because children are the masters of all the property of the Father. Therefore, I, the Father, salute you masters. You don’t need to bow down at all. Yes, regard does have to be given to young and old.”

Let us go into this paragraph. Let us go into it without preconceptions, traditions or dogmas.
Baba is just saying that God does not need worshiping. Baba is giving respect back to his “children.”
The ‘children’ inherit the property of the Father.

See that this is just a wonderful figure of language but there is no “inheritance” going on and the Father, God does not have any property. Why?
Because He is “abhogta.” (beyond experience.) Is “having” different than experiencing? 🙂
We need to experience “having” even though in Gyan we realize that no one can possess anything. Using it, is a better description.

“Pure” Gyan also assures us that everything is already within the Drama and when God is revealed to us, then we could “go to the Father’s property” in a “numberwise” fashion and only if it is in our role.

Because God is beyond any “effect” of experience, God cannot experience duality. Because God is “free from thoughts,” God cannot ‘think’ that something is good or bad.
Many times I hear the sentence: “God’s thinking.” 🙂 That is devotion. There is no knowledge there.
God is also “akarta,” meaning that “He does not do anything.” That is why the term ‘karankaravanhar,’ meaning, the “one who does through others,” exist. Therefore, any devotional idea of God which portrays God as human being with thinking abilities and the ability to do things at will is not accurate.

Just picture this point of light who is there in Parandham. Ever shiny, ever centered, ever pure, ever constant.
How is it possible for that soul to think anything such as: “This is hell?” How is it possible for Him to do anything as when we say: “Baba created this world.” How can we say:” Baba is unhappy when we do not follow Shrimat.” How can we say: “Baba is working hard for us,” etc; etc.

Please see that it is just plain knowledge from the Murli.
However, BKs have experienced the “doing,” the “thinking,” the “advice based on experience” from “up above.”
How is that possible?
That is Brahma, the father of Brahmin souls. His connection to God (BapDada) has changed in time. From the “sakar days” to “now.”
Nothing in this Drama remains ever the same.
Devotion must turn into Knowledge at some time.